One of these is not like the others......

I have been playing with the data that is provided by the SBOE site. So, tell me after the break, can you tell which one is not like the other???

Discuss, donor locations by AMOUNT GIVEN. "Under $50" refers to small donations that do not have their addresses reported.

Dalton-donors



Smathers-donors



Besse-donors



Dellinger-donors

Comments

Location, location, location.

These reports make for interesting reading. Dalton is the only candidate that takes a LOT of money from PACs. On the other hand, Dellinger gets a lot of $500-$4000 donations from California, New York, etc.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

As Mr. Spock would say . . .

Fascinating.

Intriguing, even.

Thanks for posting this information.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing
-Edmund Burke

50% of 900k is still more than 90%of 100k

What your pictures tell me (other than that you finally figured Microsoft Excel out ;-0 ) is that Dellinger outraised two of his three opponents inside North Carolina by a substantial margin.

It also tells me that this guy, who grew up in North Carolina and then was educated at Michigan and Yale Law School before returning home, has a national network of supporters and friends that can only benefit him as a spokesman for North Carolina.

I will save my negative comments for those downthread who are giving Republicans a run for their money in parochialism and bassackwardness.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

I love me some pivot tables.

I'm not sure how much I think this matters, I do think it matters a little and as I've said below there was a good chance I would have let it go if many of his emails weren't about raising money and crowing over how much money he had raised.

Now, don't make me get out my Excel and making histograms of the number of contributions of differing amounts.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

size

You might want to make the tables proportionately sized, so that the surface area of the blue space is proportional to the amount raised.

Basically, what I see here is one establishment guy with power in the State Senate vacuuming up all the money from the usual suspects, and three guys running against him - only one of whom has the financial wherewithal to do so.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

I know it shouldn't matter, should it?

But it really makes a difference to me if a candidate gets most of their money from within the district they're running to represent.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Why shouldn't it?

I get what you're saying, but I can't think of a good reason why I should ignore this.

Help me out...

I wasn't saying to ignore it.

MTBinDurham, sometimes you and I see eye to eye without realizing it.

In the LG race, it is particularly important since Dellinger has been trumpeting his fund-raising success as an achievement that adds to why we should vote for him, and he's the one that has the most money from outside NC coming in. If I were him, I'd look for other things to promote.

Sorry - it's late, and this has not been a good communication day for me at all. I hope this makes more sense.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

I was actually trying to agree with you

I think the awkwardness here is mine. I was trying to say, "yep, sure looks like something that bothers me!"

I'm kind of with you that something inside me says, "Oh, shouldn't matter!" but seriously -- why not? Why is he soliciting donations from California?

I still believe that how we get people elected is important, and shouldn't be lost in just getting the right people elected. In this case, raising big dollars from outside the state doesn't sit well with me.

Trust me, today the awkwardness is mine.

But tomorrow is another day.

I still believe that how we get people elected is important, and shouldn't be lost in just getting the right people elected. In this case, raising big dollars from outside the state doesn't sit well with me

Precisely.

On the topic of PAC's - I'm not allowed to go set out a jar and collect donations and then give it to the candidate I like best, or that I think will help me out the most. PAC's, as I see it, are doing just that. I realize it's legal -- it doesn't make it right.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

That "blank" slice

of the Besse pie consists of the numerous donations of 50 dollars or less that have been given to Dan's campaign in the last few months. For our purposes here, it's too bad that the SBOE doesn't require detailed information to be included in the report for these small donations. Each of those little checks represents a hard-working NC progressive doing what he or she can...

Let me fix that...

I changed the numbers and made multiple labels where necessary. There might be other donations under $50, but these ones are not required to have address info for whatever reason.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Free-writing Exercise.

I think it would be interesting for everyone to just freewrite about their feelings on this. Welcome to 8th grade English.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

It's really simple.

One of these campaigns is being foisted on us by a bunch of people who won't be governed by the leadership they're conspiring to elect to govern US.

I guess it depends.

For instance, I've done undergraduate, graduate, and postdoctoral fellowship all over the country. I've accumulated a lot of friends here and there. If I were running for Lt. Governor I think they would want to give me a donation. MAYBE that is what's happening, the difference being these folks are giving $1000 donations and my friends would only be able to afford about $50 (science v. law).

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

It's possible that's what's happening.

And there's nothing wrong with people looking to all of their friends/associates for donations. It's the percentage that bothers me, personally. I look at Dalton's chart, and I see a lot of other states, with the bulk coming from NC. I think that's probably what's happening.

I look at the Besse and Smathers charts, and I know immediately that these are grassroots campaigns.

I look at the Dellinger chart, and I wonder why, if he's so well connected and experienced in NC - why hasn't a higher percentage of donations come from NC?

Of course these are just charts, which give us totals without any thing else. Knowing who the out of state donors are might - might make a difference.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Sour grapes, Frank.

I expected parochialism and anti-intellectualism from republicans, not from writers on this site.

Hampton substantially outraised Besse in North Carolina. He also has a siginificant out of state network of friends and acquaintances from his days working and studying outside of North Carolina. Imagine that - people who meet and work with Hampton like him enough to want to help him run for office. Last I checked, the First Amendment extended across state lines.

Perhaps we should put a requirement in the NC Constitution that only those who have never left North Carolina should be allowed to run for office.

That raised the question, however, of whather Pat McRory could run - seeing as how he's been in Charlotte for 15 years.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

a slightly contrarian view

Sometimes a good candidate with no name recognition(or not beholding to big PACs and other big money) comes along who has to build financial support outside the state. I have certainly sent money to people outside my district or state who had progressive ideas,especially if I lived in a district with a safe incumbent. (who did not need my financial help) People see the state and federal races differently. I might support someone for a state race in another state because the people there are crying out for better representation.

At the same time, it is true that a candidate needs the backing of the voters in his/her own district.When is the start/stop point for helping a candidate to reach the voters to win their support?

I think you make a good point.

And, I think if Dellinger hadn't made so many emails from his campaign focus on how much money he had, I probably wouldn't have even noticed/cared.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Where doesn't bother me like it used to

After watching the good old boy$ close ranks around Hagan in the Democratic money chase for Senate, I'm all for Neal going wherever he has to in order to fund his campaign. If the out of state money is from individuals backing good progressive candidates, I'm all for it. If the out of state money is from corporate interests trying to get their guy in the catbird seat, well, that's a horse of a different color (he said mixing metaphors to a fault).

I can see that in the Neal campaign.

That's why the pie charts, while interesting, don't tell us enough about the donors. I also think that a race for US Senate is different from a race for Lt. Governor. A progressive, intelligent US Senator affects the entire country, even if he doesn't represent them. The Lt. Gov. of North Carolina affects North Carolina.

So I see a big difference there.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Gotcha

I'm afraid I'm becoming less and less appreciative of borders in general. It's the old butterfly effect.

One dumb ass in a state far, far away decides to pass a law prohibiting, say, abortion, and the next thing you know there's a full-fledged stampede in 49 other states to do the same.

In my heart of hearts, I believe we are all responsible for everything. A child dies in Kenya because of political unrest? I see that as my responsibility. A woman gets stoned to death in Afghanistan because of religious intolerance? Same same.

This is why I have such a problem with wild-eyed nationalism. It starts with "us-them" that turns to "screw them" at the drop of a hint.

I get your point, though.

I don't disagree with you on this.

In my heart of hearts, I believe we are all responsible for everything. A child dies in Kenya because of political unrest? I see that as my responsibility. A woman gets stoned to death in Afghanistan because of religious intolerance? Same same.

I agree completely on a spiritual, emotional, and intellectual level.

Lets go with the butterfly wings analogy. I've always liked it. If you gave $1000 to a Kenyan politician (if that's even allowed), I would question how well you understood the situation in Kenya and what unintended consequences your $1000 would put into action. Even though you have a dear friend there, without actually living in the situation day in and day out, you can have no way of knowing what your thousand butterfly wings will flutter into being.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't give money where ever you think it will do good things. I do think, though, that we have a better sense of how our fluttering wings will affect a situation the closer we are to it.

And that's all the philosophy I can handle on one cup of coffee.

In his original post, Robert pointed out the difference in where the money was coming from in the LG race. I don't discount the possibility of friends, associates, relatives, etc. wanting to donate to someone running for office. I've donated to people running in places where I've lived before. The problem for me is that if a politician is taking a lot of money from outside the district he's running to represent, and not able to raise the same amount within the district, I have to question why. Without seeing the individual donor lists, it's impossible to make any more conclusions.

As for some nutjob getting elected in another state and passing laws that are regressive, etc., we can do a good job of protecting ourselves from that trickling to us by being sure that the individuals who are elected in NC are beholden only to the voters of NC - and that they are progressive, sensitive people.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Pretty good stuff

for being insufficiently caffeinated!

the disconnect

The problem for me is that if a politician is taking a lot of money from outside the district he's running to represent, and not able to raise the same amount within the district, I have to question why."

The pie chart shows half of his money coming from inside NC.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

I think she was saying as much.

Although, 50% from out of state still seems like a lot to me. Especially coming in big checks.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

"big checks"

Come on, Robert - you've been fundraising for JRE all year. Are you going to encouragepeople to give less than they can afford?

The law limits contributions. I can't afford the limit. But others can.

Unless you find under the table donations that exceed the limits, $4000 from one donor is not going to skew a guy's policy.

John Edwards got $1250 from me this year. Think I can call him up and change his mind on gay rights?

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

plus, keep in mind Hampton's January

He raised a substantial amount of money in January - much of it in $20.08 increments.

As of January 25, Hampton had more cash on hand than Dalton.

Hampton is substantially more progressive than Dalton.

Besse and Smathers both had subpar performances in fundraising, whether inside or outside the state, and would enter a general election against Pittenger essentially unarmed.

Like it or not, you have to have money to run, until the GA does the right thing and extends the public funding law to the entire council of state.

You have a chance to support a truly viable guy who would be the most progressive statewide elected official in my memory in North Carolina, or a truly viable guy who would be more of the same.

You choose.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

Question about the primary

We're still under the 40% rule, right? So as long as I convince lots of people to vote "not Dalton," we don't have to worry about splitting the progressive vote?

Hampton has done basically nothing to make me want to support him over Besse and Smathers, but I'd of course vote for him over Dalton. Until then, are we safe saying, may the best progressive win?

Intellectually Dishonest

The laws require cash on hand to be reported for June 30th and December 31st. And yet twice now Hampton has fundraised an extra two or three weeks and declared himself to be the winner of the money primary over Dalton. Its not only intellectually dishonest, its silly and childish.

I dont care who raises the most money. I care about who can do the job the best and who has the best ideas.

As for viability, in the January poll Dellinger was in last with 7% with Dalton and Smathers at 9%, and Besse at 8%. I wouldnt say that anyone is "not viable" based upon support from voters.

"Keep the Faith"

"Keep the Faith"

Is it your position

that a candidate cannot state his financial standing at times other than the official reporting deadline?

Is it further your position that Dellinger did not have a substantially better year than Besse or Smathers, and competitive with Dalton, as of December 31?

Not sure I understand your position to be anything other than "I don't personally like one candidate so I am going to trash him." Talk about childish and intellectually dishonest...

Your jihad against my friend is really getting tiresome. Here's a suggestion - wake up on the right side of the bed once in a while.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

answers

...that a candidate cannot state his financial standing at times other than the official reporting deadline?

He can tell us how much money he has at any time. But saying "I have more money at this date" is dishonest when he is using two different data points.

For instance, if Dellinger had filed his paperwork January 1st and said, "I have raised more than Dalton" and used Dalton's numbers from July that would have been dishonest. There is no difference.

Is it further your position that Dellinger did not have a substantially better year than Besse or Smathers, and competitive with Dalton, as of December 31?

Thats tangential. I dont care how either of them did in competition with Dalton. Dalton is the status quo. He isnt a damn Republican, much as your friend would like to paint him as one.

"Keep the Faith"

"Keep the Faith"

yes, but

Yes, Dellinger is substantially more progressive than Dalton. That's true.

However, this is not a two-man race, no matter how the biggest fundraisers would like to frame it.

If Besse or Smathers gets the nomination, then you can count on that money coming in, right? Or will people give only to Dellinger?

Re: out-of-state donations. I don't think a donation here or there adds up to much as far as being problematic, but when half of your fundraising comes from folks outside the state, I start to worry about the agenda. If a U.S. Presidential candidate got half his money from outside the U.S., you'd find that objectionable, I imagine.

It's not a disqualifier, but it's cautionary. Most importantly, it's vital that NC citizens know that elections can't be bought in our state, that candidates must win on their merits not their bank accounts.

Scrutiny Hooligans - http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us

so American citizens are just like Libyans?

Come on, think about your statement for a second, Gordon. This is not money from out of the country. It's not even close to the same thing.

Assuming for the purposes of argument that a check from an individual = the ability to affect policy positions of a candidate (I do not agree, but let's just assume), what agenda could progressives from around the country have that they would be able to pressure a North Carolinian into espousing, which would not be something that progressives here would support?

And to your first point, I agree that Besse and Smathers are also more progressive than Dalton. I will not, however, grant you that they are more progressive than Dellinger.

I have been a friend of Hampton's for a long time, but I like all these guys - especially Smathers - but you have to be able to compete.

North Carolina is a major state with at least four major media markets. You can't run here statewide on the back of a pickup truck with a megaphone. You just can't do it.

Believe me. I tried to run a judicial campaign here on $130,000. You might as well try to redirect the Mississippi with a water pistol.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

Well then let's have a different conversation

Is Dellinger more progressive than Besse or Smathers?

If Dalton had raised half his money from outside the state, would Dellinger be attacking him over it?

If Besse or Smathers were to get the nomination, would donors then fund their campaigns more thoroughly?

Would Dellinger aid the nominee in fundraising if it were Besse or Smathers?

Scrutiny Hooligans - http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us

I find it amusing

I find it amusing that someone who supports John Edwards because of his stance on issues, and in spite of his financial disadvantage, now tells us that we shouldnt support Besse or Smathers because they dont have enough money.

"Keep the Faith"

"Keep the Faith"

I don't think you'll find

anywhere where I said do not support the candidate you support, regardless of his financial disadvantages.

I said that Dellinger is the progressive with the greatest ability to beat Dalton in the primary and have resources in the general.

And I don't think you can find anyone in this field that is as different from his opponents on the key issues as Edwards is different from Clinton on the issue of what the Democratic Party should be focused on nationally.

I support public financing.

If this was a publicly financed race, I'd still support Hampton Dellinger. And I'd still shake hands with the other three candidates and wish them luck and be polite to their supporters.

You could try that.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

Good Luck!

You're really not going to answer any of my questions?

I think this is a fair one for all the candidates:

Will you support the Democratic nominee through campaigning and fundraising?

Like I've said before, while I think that Dalton and Dellinger represent the status quo, neither of them is an evil overlord. I prefer Besse and Smathers, and I take offense to Dellinger painting the race as a two-man affair.

If it's all about who can raise the most money, then what does Dellinger need my support for? He's got the money to get all the support he needs by your calculus, and his out-of-state fundraising means he's got plenty of room to expand his in-state base of funding.

No matter who gets the nomination, you'll find me supporting the bejesus out of them. Let's hope that Hampton Dellinger and Walter Dalton are willing to do the same.

Scrutiny Hooligans - http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us

I'm not Hampton

so I can't answer for him. And he fully intends to be the nominee, so asking him what will happen if he loses is like asking me whether I will appeal a jury verdict that hasn't come back yet. I refuse to consider the possibility.

But putting that aside, I don't think you would find Dellinger, a lifelong Democratic activist, campaigning for the Republican.

On the rest of your post, I really wish people would quit putting words in my mouth. Certainly we need votes more than anything else. And as one of his volunteer organizers, I can tell you that this is very much a grassroots campaign. We will have a precinct-level volunteer network which will be second to none.

Ground war. Air war. It helps to be able to fight both at the same time.

But you shouldn't vote for a candidate because he has a lot of money. You should vote for hampton, in my opinion, because he has the best combination of positions, experience and youth.

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

Gordon equates Americans and Libyans

and Blue South is on a jihad against Hampton, according to you.

Interesting analogies, Dr. Frank.

It would seem you don't believe your arguments stand on their merits.
 
News of the 10th district: See Pat Go Bye Bye,

whatever

"85% of Republicans are Democrats who don't know what's going on." -Robert Kennedy, Jr.

"Man is free at the moment he wishes to be." -Voltaire

The US Senate is very different.

I gave money to Webb, Tester and Casey in the last showdown. Not much, but enough that if everyone did it they'd have a good bankroll (which they did). I have a stake in their election.

Another thing you have to look at is the amounts. Dalton has little slivers because they are little amounts. Dellinger has big slices because they are big amounts. Those are not total # of donations from that state, they are percent of all dollars raised.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

parochial

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

Anglico's right. Even in this petty circumstance of where donations originate, we show our tribe mentality by saying some "other" is not worthy of influencing our lives here. I don't know who gave Dellinger the money from California, but it's just fine with me. As long as the information is available so I can tell if it's some evil Pharmaceutical Company or a little old lady who was once helped by Dellinger across the street, I'm cool. In fact, I want all of us to influence all of us. That dialectic, I hope, will one day get us all the best answers.

I've never been much on Lennon

Great vamp in that song. The words are a little insipid.

Always more of a George guy myself...

It's lawyers, man.

I want all of us to influence all of us.

The problem is that those with the most money will do the most influencing in an election.

And those without money?

They're just not that influential.

Never in my wildest dreams did I think I'd have to reiterate that point on this forum. We're talking about CAMPAIGN FINANCING, people. Not butterflies. Not world peace. Money and influence.

And I'd look out. I think zombie John Lennon is looking for you (having spun right out of his grave).

money money money campaign

money money money

campaign finance. butterflies. world peace.

poor people. rich people.

wild dreams. wild flowers. wild ride.

capitalists base everything on money. that's stupid.

My idealistic comment was just that -- idealistic.

And here's another one -- no one person should have too much money. So that would solve the problem -- no one too rich and no one too poor. Let's get our populist candidates to support that -- a ceiling on income of say, I don't know 1 million per year. Is that enough to live on?

Then, all of us could influence all of us without dollars on our brains

send Zombie John this way.

I've always wanted to meet him.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

I am resisting using an emoticon.

This made me laugh so hard, staff came into my office to see what was going on.

Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

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