An open letter to Larry Kissell


Dear Larry.

I remember our first conversation like it was yesterday. You called me to ask for advice about your campaign, and also to ask for money. I gave you both. I told you to dump the ridiculous orange t-shirt you were wearing and put on a tie. I asked you to always tell the truth.

My wife and I maxed out in contributions to your campaign. I opened my house to you for a major fundraiser. I got one of my best friends to do the same. My friends and I collectively raised tens of thousands of dollars, all based what you told us.

You stood on the back deck at my house when you promised to be a thoughtful representative in Congress. You promised you would put the people of North Carolina first in everything you did. You told me you would fight for what is right and fair for regular people, people who weren't getting a fair shake, people who were suffering because of the aftershocks of years of government by special interests.

You called me three times to thank me for my help. You said you couldn't have done it without me. You told me I could count on you to keep your word.

But you're not doing that. You're not thinking through the facts of healthcare reform, like you said you would. You're relying on lies from special interests. You're pretending like the current healthcare system is a sustainable proposition, when you know it is not.

You see citizens in your district being dumped by insurance companies every day and you're not stepping up to do something about it. You see people going bankrupt because of the lack of health reform every day and you're ignoring them. You're also ignoring your own CBO estimates that show how healthcare reform actually saves money in the long run.

I've listened to all your explanations, Larry, and they don't hold water. They make about as much sense as that orange t-shirt you had plastered all over your first website. They are boneheaded and they are wrong.

You took my advice once, Larry Kissell. Now I'm asking you to take it one more time. I'm asking you to keep your word. Not just to me, but to the thousands of people who believed what you said.

James Protzman


Given all of that, Dave

Dave, if (a big "if") all of that was true, do you think that possibly...just possibly...there would have been another way to deal with Saddam Hussein? Was war the only answer? Was that what the International community really wanted? Be honest, my friend. With all the American lives lost and all the bucks spent, are you truly certain this was our best approach in dealing with Iraq?

Me? I do not think so.

The problem was...

...that Saddam was a genocidal loose cannon. He was filling his country with mass graves, he was exterminating the Marsh Arabs, he had a history of invading his neighbors & using poison gas to massacre enemies, real and imagined, foreign and domestic.

He was also stockpiling uranium. It now appears that he was much further from building nukes than we believed at the time, but, OTOH, Qaddafi was much closer to building them than we believed at the time, and Qaddafi gave up his nuclear weapons program because we took out Saddam. So the fact is that by invading Iraq we eliminated a nuclear threat, just not the one we expected.

What's more, Saddam kept popping off SAM missiles at our planes, which were patrolling the non-fly zones -- acts of war, every time.

What's more, it seemed that the only way to make him marginally behave was to keep 100,000 troops camped in Saudi Arabia, and that we simply could not do. The Saudis wouldn't have permitted it, even if we'd been able to manage it. It was a safe bet that if we withdrew, as soon as our troops were gone Saddam would be back to his old ways, and probably emboldened by his victory. So we either had to either use out troops to oust him or give up and go home, and let him do what he wished, to whomever he wished -- a catastrophe, sooner or later, for certain.

President Bush tried hard to find a peaceful solution. Right up to the end he offered Saddam the opportunity to go into comfortable exile, and save his country from war. But Saddam refused.

Really, I don't see what we could have done differently. Do you? (Obviously, I'm talking about the invasion, not how we handled the occupation & pacification, which could have been done better.)

Tell me honestly, what you think we could have done, other than invade?

I think you are so delusional

President Bush lied hard to find a warful solution. Neocon dreams of oil and profits for Cheney's Halliburton dancing in his head he blundered ahead despite the weapons inspectors reports and the millions of people in the streets all over the world condemning his action.

Could we have just NOT invaded Iraq? Instead, just trap Bin Laden in his cave in Tora Bora when we had the chance? It's just that that would not have given Bush his entree into the Middle East that he wanted so much.

Since Saddam was installed by the US backed CIA coup, he was our dictator after all.


You're one sick zealot, Dave, and badly in need of a new screen name. Maybe ncdave4deathexceptforfetuses?

Tell me honestly, what you think we could have done, other than invade?

Dave and his biggest enabler was?

Ronald Reagan. Remember who sold him all the chemicals to build the WMD's when he had them? Ronald Reagan. Dave if you want to play this game you never are going to win. Both sides, Democratic and Republican administrations, have played less than laudable roles at different times under the guise of national security while they were really promoting the interests of their corporate masters. No one is a virgin in this game.

Why do so many leftists just make things up

Why do so many leftists just make things up, to smear the USA?

Saddam never got WMDs or any help making them from President Reagan or any other U.S. administration. That is vicious, delusional nonsense.

I still would like to know why leftists don't care about Saddam's genocidal campaign to exterminate the Marsh Arabs, the hundreds of mass graves filled with the bodies of Saddam's innocent victims, the millions of unborn American babies dying by choice, etc.? The things that break my heart don't seem to affect yours at all. Why is that? What ever happened to "bleeding-heart liberals."

I know how the Dodo bird became extinct. But what happened to the bleeding-heart liberals?

Make things up?

Who makes things up Dave? Here That document is quite well referenced. "Saddam never got WMDs or any help making them from President Reagan or any other U.S. administration." Really Dave? You might want to revise that belief. Dave, don't let facts get in the way of your delusions. "What ever happened to "bleeding-heart liberals."" Our hearts don't bleed for the same things than yours. BTW, didn't you read the part where I told you that there are no virgins in this game? Finally Dave, ignoring history and facts does not make you a better person or a better American.


You "progressives" blame the United States for everything! The leftists attack voters in Iraq, and you even blame the USA for that!

That's a caricature of liberals, but you just gave us a perfect example of where it is absolutely true.

I guess you think that, since it is America's fault that Iraq now has free elections, it is also America's fault when the leftists there kill people to try to keep them from voting.

For your information, the ~2,000,000 people whose violent deaths are blamed on Saddam and his henchmen actually were caused by Saddam and his henchmen: They died in wars of conquest which he launched, in his genocidal campaigns to exterminate disfavored minorities, and in his purges of domestic enemies, real and imagined, and their families & friends & neighbors. It's not some bogus "excess deaths" calculation by leftist epidemiologists, and it doesn't count murders unconnected to Saddam & his henchmen. It is the people whose deaths Saddam really caused.

A Caricature

is the world you live in and how you distort logic. Like I told you earler: don't let facts get in the way of your delusions. No one here is defending Saddam or denying that he was a murderer, but you can't help yourself. Can you Dave? It makes you feel better, doesn't it Dave? Dave you want to know how fucked up the Reagan administration was: it was helping both sides kill each other, supplying the weponry, the intelligence and the chemicals that caused many of those terrible deaths you are talking about. You get that: helping both sides kill each other. No one here is saying the U.S. single handedly did it, but to deny that the U.S. played a significant role along with other countries, mind you, flies in the face of reality. All of this is well documented. Are you so weak Dave that you can't deal with well documented facts? You call yourself pro-life? I see Dave, you only care about some deaths. Other deaths you just can't deal with so you just deny it ever happened. How despicable of you Dave. You think you are more American or a better American than I am Dave? Fuck you Dave.

That was a good message

That was a good message because it does speak the truth in many ways. I know I am looked at being a republican here which I am but I am not stupid even though many will say so here. Your post is a good one and what you have said is true in a lot of ways. I do not like the way you put it but it is true anyway mostly.

I don't want to see it come

it was predicted a long time ago that we would only be destroyed from "within". But like everyone else, we are ready.

GW's 2nd Inaugural Address Comes to Mind

Could someone please explain to me the need to have US forces deployed in over 150 different countries on any given day spread throughout the world? What is this insatiable appetite we have for imperialism? Besides, isn't maintaining an empire rather expensive? Perhaps it is time to reconsider George Washington's 2nd Inaugural Address. One certainly can't say the man was a dove and didn't know first hand the cost of war. If anyone wasn't afraid to mix it up against the world's super power at the time, and against all odds, it was George Washington. Perhaps it's time to listen to some wisdom from the past.

Farewell Address

Sorry folks; it's been a long week. George Washington's Farewell Address.
The 2nd is too short to address anything at all.
I need an adult beverage and a good meal.

I think we are alike in many ways, Thinker

I need an adult beverage and a good meal.

Again, have a great weekend (even though it is only Thursday). I will be going "out of town" unless plans change, so I will be absent from the "chat" here through the weekend.


GW predicts Chaos for the future at going away party?

George Washington's Farewell Address.
The 2nd is too short to address anything at all.* Thinking of Ancient history gives me headaches

True! It was simple and brief and he didn't speak since it was written to the citizens and Congress.

1. GW said to stay out foreign wars in Europe since it goes nowhere and those fools have been fighting among themselves for 1700 years and never settle anything about real liberty or freedom of religion for humanity.

2. The French Revolution was a bunch of crap and loaded with Secret Societies that wanted to rule the World and surpress real freedom with continue wars of aggression..... Sorted like Ike's farewell address. " The greatest enemy to the American people is the growth of the Military Industrial Complex

3 We are a Republic and not a Democracy where the rights of a minority is protected from the majority [mob rule]with the rule of law.

4. The other greatest enemy to the United States is factions or political parties that seek to destroy the Constitution of the United States......Sorted like the present or both major parties who claim to be defending the Consitution, but in fact is clobbing the Constitution and Individual rights of it's citizens

Looks like old GW had it right 240 years ago about the present idiots running the Federal and State governments into the ground on massive debt and with billion of laws that nobody has any idea what they are?

The Madame is Right!

"Looks like old GW had it right 240 years ago about the present idiots running the Federal and State governments into the ground on massive debt and with billion of laws that nobody has any idea what they are?"

Couldn't have summed it up any better. It always amazes me how timeless and relevant the writings of our Founding Fathers are, especially today.

For more depth...

...especially w/r/t Constitutional law, I highly recommend the Federalist Papers.

Get a copy with a glossary, and read the glossary first, since a few words have changed. But they are very readable, and VERY educational.

thanks for nothing.

You used SEIU funds to run your campaign, you promised a lot, and you let a whole lot of hard working americans down. We do not have the luxury of disposable income in our house. People trusted you. WE WILL NOT BE SILENT!!!!!!